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Comments Script - what features?

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Dave
Staff / Moderator

Aug 19, 2002, 12:37 AM

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Comments Script - what features?	Can't Post

Have you guys found anything you like yet?

What exact features are you looking for? We've been looking at a number of article comments systems and they seem to have a wide range of options.

Dave Edis - Senior Developer
interactivetools.com

(This post was edited by Dave on Aug 22, 2002, 2:26 PM)

MalaK_3araby
User

Aug 19, 2002, 9:40 AM

Post #2 of 37 (36980 views)
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Re: [Dave] Comments - External script - need help installing [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To

Have you guys found anything you like yet?

What exact features are you looking for? We've been looking at a number of article comments systems and they seem to have a wide range of options.

Nop. nothing here.

This is what i am looking for:
- User Registering Option and/or Moderation.
- Admin Edit/Delete comments.
- Store comments in External Files (So that it does not conflict with MySql V2 of AM)
- Use of SSI
Oh yeah .. and Easy to setup :)

BTW, is comments and ratings in the to-do list og v.2 of AM ?

Thanks for caring.

--------------
Sure you can spell it, but do you get it?

(This post was edited by MalaK_3araby on Aug 19, 2002, 9:41 AM)

Dave
Staff / Moderator

Aug 22, 2002, 2:28 PM

Post #3 of 37 (36956 views)
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Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

I've detached this thread and moved it to the top. Can everyone else comment on what you'd like to see in a comments script? We're thinking about making one as an add-on. : )

Dave Edis - Senior Developer
interactivetools.com

taylor
User

Aug 23, 2002, 8:43 AM

Post #4 of 37 (36937 views)
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Re: [Dave] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Dave-

Thank you for considering this. What an amazing add-on this would be. I agree with malak_3araby:

- User Registering Option and/or Moderation.
- Admin Edit/Delete comments.
- Store comments in External Files (So that it does not conflict with MySql V2 of AM)
- Use of SSI
- Easy to setup

PLUS:

An interface sort of similar to movabletype.org's in that for each article, there would be 3 text links: 1 for "Rate this Article" (separate, admin configurable size pop up that allows users to rate each article on a scale from 1 to 10), "Comment on this Article" (again, a separate window pops up showing the comments posted as well as a way for new users to post their own--logging IPs, of course). The other bit of text would be the average score that particular article had on the scale from 1 to 10. Imagefolio's gallery software has a nice pop-up rating feature.

If there could be a way to turn the "comment on this article" feature on or off for *each article* (say, an option in the AM admin section) AND a way to allow only some (or all) posts to be viewable, that would be incredible. This way, somebody couldn't go on and post nonsense or obscenities at will.

I have vbulletin (not yet incorporated into my site), but it seems this kind of add-on would be much better for commenting directly on our daily content--instead of setting up forums and manually adding links, etc. BUT, how could all of us AMers who have vbulletin (mysql) or UBB or ikonboard get your possible "commenting" add-on to work with our community boards--specifically, the user registration part that stores names and passwords (so folks who register for our vbulletin board don't have to register a new name for the AM add-on?

Whew, sorry for all that info. I really really hope you decide to do this. This would be so amazing, Dave.

Taylor

Dave
Staff / Moderator

Aug 23, 2002, 11:59 AM

Post #5 of 37 (36930 views)
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Re: [taylor] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Taylor, Thanks for all the feedback. So why don't you want to use your existing forum? Is it just because of the integration issues? If the rating was taken care of and there was some easy way to have it link to the forum would that suffice?

The one thing we want to avoid is re-creating a forum, because a software program that is designed to be a forum is always going to be better than one that has a couple forum features. If everyone wants a full blown forum, the best solution is probably find ways to link up with existing forums. If it's just basic comments, then a add-on perhaps would be better. I can think of a couple ideas to implement article rating using the spare fields already. The problem with a "basic comments" script it's really easy to start wanting features you'd find in a full blown forum...

Let me know which direction you'd prefer and any thoughts you have on that.

Also, how should the comments be displayed? Linked to a forum from the article or below the article?

Thanks! : )

Dave Edis - Senior Developer
interactivetools.com

taylor
User

Aug 23, 2002, 12:53 PM

Post #6 of 37 (36924 views)
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Re: [Dave] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To

Taylor, Thanks for all the feedback. So why don't you want to use your existing forum? Is it just because of the integration issues? If the rating was taken care of and there was some easy way to have it link to the forum would that suffice?

Also, how should the comments be displayed? Linked to a forum from the article or below the article?

Thanks! : )

Dave-

Thanks for replying and for being so involved! We really appreciate all the hard work lately.

To answer your questions: Ease of use/integration. I don't know how to integrate my vbulletin in with my AM articles...easily. What I mean by that is I don't want to add new forums manually for each new article posted. If there was a way you could suggest on how to do this, that would be great. Otherwise, I think a simple, hassle-free rate and comment add-on to AM would suffice for most of us.

Oh, I would maybe have the "comment" and "rate" links where the "email story" and "print story" links reside and display the comments in a separate window. If there was a way to break up the comments that are posted (into separate links--like vbulletin and UBB) that would be great, also--that way, if there are 167 comments to an article, users don't have to scroll down a page forever and ever to read the various comments posted.

Just my humble opinion, though.

Taylor

(This post was edited by taylor on Aug 23, 2002, 1:16 PM)

terrill
User

Aug 23, 2002, 1:10 PM

Post #7 of 37 (36921 views)
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Re: [Dave] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Dave,

I'm not absolutely certain I have a grasp on the request, but, let me throw something out that might give you ideas (Brainless-Storming):

* Articles alread follow a predictable format:

article_NN.shtml

Couldn't "user comments" go into:

article_NNuc.shtml

* If reader comments WERE desired for a specific article, then check a fieldN which inserts something like $user_comments$ in the article. When published, the engine includes links to add comments, and displays those already made by viewers and approved.

* Comments from viewers are NOT directly added to the article_NNuc file. They can be stored in an article_NNxc file until reviewed. (Logistical note: When the "reviewing" software opens, rename the xc file to XC+time. Reduces file locking and other clashes. If a second person started a review, that file wouldn't be seen... unless viewers had made NEW comments). After review, those approved for inclusion are then added to the articleNNuc file, and the XC file is dicarded.

* Could be modified to integrate with RDBMS when v2 is released.

taylor
User

Aug 23, 2002, 1:21 PM

Post #8 of 37 (36918 views)
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Re: [terrill] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Terrill-

The only problem with your suggestion is the new upgrade to AM lets admins break the old naming structure (thank God!). So, if we want to name articles completelynewname1.html, completelynewname2.html, etc. we can. And I definitely will be renaming mine.

Taylor

terrill
User

Aug 23, 2002, 3:00 PM

Post #9 of 37 (36909 views)
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Re: [taylor] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Taylor,

If you happen to have been following my post on the "cats.cgi" script, *your* file names are kept in the data files for Artman. I used the default names purely as an example.

That is: Artman allows you to choose your own file names and extensions, now. So the important part would be the additional xc, XC, etc.

-- Terrill --
[quote]

"Evaporating expectations of quality:

1980's paradigm: If it's worth implementing once, it's worth implementing twice.
1990's paradigm: Ship the prototype!
2000's paradigm: Ship the idea!"

---Larry Rosler:
http://www.perl.com/pub/a/2000/06/rosler.html

[/quote]

MalaK_3araby
User

Aug 23, 2002, 5:12 PM

Post #10 of 37 (36901 views)
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Re: [taylor] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi all .. and really good feed back from everyone.

Re: Comments and Rating for AM
I might be missing something ...
are we talking about a Comments system developed by ITools and integrates with AM?
I thought its would be a temp solution with an external script until AM.2. is out.
So .. yeah .. Great comments by taylor .. On/Off comments per article is great indeed .. because some article are just messages/info/links/announcements and comments are not always welcome then :)

Hang on a second .. i have to look at other posts cuz i forgot what elase i liked (how come when you reply you do not see the whole thread?)

Oh yeah .. rating and commenting is done via a pop-up window.
Also .. new comments are displayed first.
Now in tha case you get so many comments on an article (25+) .. multi page comes to mind with format such as: << < 1 2 3 4 > >>.

Re: Comments and integration with VBulletin
Sounds good ... but keep it as an option please.
Not everyone has a liscence for VB, or want to use it.
I have a customer thats on a cheap hosting option that does not provide MySql.
Another thing, i would really hate to start a thread for every article manually .. i tried this method and its so tedious .. i ended up with so many Empty threads where users didn't feel like commenting.
Vbulletin is to soon has its own CMS (VB3) .
I am a big fan of VBulletin, but i belive its an independent software and has nothing to do with AM.

--------------
Sure you can spell it, but do you get it?

mromero
Novice

Aug 24, 2002, 9:07 PM

Post #11 of 37 (36881 views)
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Re: [Dave] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

My wish list:

Multiple page support
A.M lets you break up the content into multiple pages very easily by just specifying a keyword in the content. The software will take care of generating files for each page.

Re-generate Content
A.M. allows you to re-generate the content for your website very easily. This way you can change a template, and just regenerate the content so that all the pages have the new design now.

Search engine friendly pages
Authors can key in the Keywords and description related to the article, which is automatically inserted in the META area of the page, offering a search engine friendly website. This version also features a search engine friendly URL system - without the "?" in the URL by using a special Apache feature.

Handling External Links
Links specified as external links will be opened in a new window, which will have a link back to your website in the top-frame. Something similar to the window you see when accessing a site from Hotmail.

Data Synchronization
This feature helps you to maintain an local copy of the website for offline editing. All changes can then be exported to the online server using the Data Synchronization feature.

MySQL/PHP
MySQL/PHP backend for blazing fast performance that scales up to the largest sites - no need to fear becoming too popular.

Best wishes

Thomas
User

Aug 25, 2002, 7:06 AM

Post #12 of 37 (36870 views)
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Re: [Dave] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

I would sincerely love an integrated comments feature for AM.

I have followed your previous suggestions and created something that I can use with a basic form script and some creative use of the forms for templates. This can be seen here...

http://www.ivf.net/artman/publish/cat_index_6.shtml

I have 3 images, one blank, then

This is called by a pulldown art_field6 =>
Comments (no_comments, comments, no_more_comments) which then fits in to the article template, the comments are in art_field7

Code

<P><a href="#comments"><img src=http://www.ivf.net/artman/images/$art_field6$.jpg border=0><br> 
                    </a>$art_field7$</P>

This is linked to a form at the bottom of each page (way down) - there is a form on every page whether I want comments on not
Frown

I would love if this was integrated into AM so I could manage it easily, and select which articles should have comments (preferably stand alone without login or forums), and if the number of comments could be shown on the front page. If the comments were stored and I recieved an email telling me to go and approve, delete or edit, and when this is done the pages are updated automatically.

Also, and I know this is demanding Wink

I would love a rating feature like downloads.com <http://download.com.com/3302-2143-1591065.html?tag=mta> just the thumbs up and thumbs down with an overall rating of thumbs up or down. For me this would be wonderful and everything I need (at the moment Smile

) I know others would prefer a five star rating instead...

Keep up the great work!!!!!!

taylor
User

Aug 26, 2002, 11:37 AM

Post #13 of 37 (36834 views)
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Re: [Dave] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hey Dave-

Any word on this add-on? Is it a go, then?

(keeps fingers crossed and says silent prayer...) Wink

Taylor

Dave
Staff / Moderator

Aug 26, 2002, 1:54 PM

Post #14 of 37 (36817 views)
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Re: [taylor] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Yes, we'd like to do something. Still trying to figure out the ideal setup. Here's what I'm thinking we can do.

Article Rating Add-on

We can create a rating add-on that would keep track of the rating (between 1 to 5) and total number of votes and display these as a number of stars (images) or something of that nature. We could do this by using some existing spare fields or creating some new fields. Since the rating data would be stored with the article it should be very easy to add to the output with standard placeholders.

Comments Add-on (stand alone)

We can create a simple comments add-on that would allow users to submit comments. We don't want to re-create a forum (see next option) so there wouldn't be any user authentication. The admin could flag articles as accepting comments or not and choose whether all comments get posted live right away or need to be approved by admin. There would be some functionality for the admin to approve or erase comments.

Comments Add-on (use existing forum)

For users who have forum software already, it's probably the best system and place for article comments. It's very difficult to build something as full featured as a forum without actually ending up building a forum. : ) The key issue seems to be ease of use. I'm thinking we could create a script which would either redirect users to a active forum/thread for a particular article or create one if none existed. I'm thinking this would work like this: The user would click a link "user comments". The link would call a script and pass the article number. The script would check to see if it knows the URL for the thread for that article. If it doesn't it would submit a form in the forum (as the admin user), create a thread with a default message and link to the original article (perhaps title too) and redirect the user to that. All subsequent users would be directly automatically. Then all you would have to do is select "allow comments yes/no" in the forum and you'd be ready to go.

The admin would have to enter their username/password (or a username and password with admin access) into the script and the script would add a thread by sending a HTTP web request just like a user does when they submit in a form in their browser.

---

Comments, thoughts, ideas?

Dave Edis - Senior Developer
interactivetools.com

taylor
User

Aug 26, 2002, 2:27 PM

Post #15 of 37 (36810 views)
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Re: [Dave] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Yeah--I think your ideas sound great. I love the idea for images for the rating system. Brilliant. Hopefully, that can be user/admin customised.

Allowing us to approve or delete comments is a great feature, as well.

I think I'll use my vbulletin software for actual community building. Your addons would be so much easier to integrate into our content than if we had to set up a forum for each article posted--a nightmare!

Could you break up the comments like a ubb thread? What I mean is, if there are, like, 170 comments posted for an article, I wouldn't want to scroll down that page--it would take forever! But, if, say, after 10 comments, it breaks up into multiple pages, then that would be awesome. Plus, a place to put banner ad code [yeah, I'm that ad impression geek who likes to break up pages :) ] Oh man, that would be great, Dave.

Pop ups windows, too!

movabletype.org has some nice features.

Alright, keep us posted. I can't wait to hear back from you! Cool

Taylor

Dave
Staff / Moderator

Aug 26, 2002, 2:35 PM

Post #16 of 37 (36807 views)
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Re: [taylor] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

So you'd rather a simpler comments system that using your existing forum? Really? The idea with the 3rd suggestion was you could have a single forum, say "Article Discussions" and it would automatically create new threads with the article data so people could discuss it there?

No big deal with way, just curious as to the reasons for the preference.

Is anyone else interested in easier integration with existing forums?

I was looking at the comments system on wilwheaton.com (looks like it's mt based).

Dave Edis - Senior Developer
interactivetools.com

taylor
User

Aug 26, 2002, 2:46 PM

Post #17 of 37 (36804 views)
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Re: [Dave] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Oh....I was so excited I didn't see that part!

I like choices. Can it do both---I mean, could I turn off the "plug into existing forum softaware" option off if I wanted to go "lite"?

How is it possible to have the software create the threads for me? That's pretty amazing. But with all of those forums, is it hard on your server? I have vbulletin php/mysql and I plan on posting 3-5 articles per day.

Hehe--the whilwheaton site is powered by movabletype. Wink

Let me know..

Taylor

synergy
User

Aug 26, 2002, 2:51 PM

Post #18 of 37 (36804 views)
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Re: [Dave] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

"Is anyone else interested in easier integration with existing forums?"

HERE, HERE...!

afaik, 90% of all internetforums are based on 3 different products. so if you could make it possible that am can interact with those the way you described, it would be great and would ease the administration very much.
it would be cool if one could see the last topics in the automaticllay created MB under the article (as a teaser so that people might click on them). therefore, the best of a simple commentfeature and a full MB could be combined imo.

i also very much like the "vote article" feature!

and again, if you could provide a "group articles"-function which would allow articles to get grouped in a flexible manner by the editors, so that the headlines (and as an option maybe even the summaries) of related articles would appear under the main article also (as well as all types of media, downloads etc.) as well as "vote article" and some others like "workflowmanagement"("email author" etc.) i mentioned before in 2.0, i can't think of any more feature i would want.

well, at least currently...

Wink

kind regards!

ps: userdefined passwords!

(This post was edited by synergy on Aug 26, 2002, 4:40 PM)

Dave
Staff / Moderator

Aug 26, 2002, 3:05 PM

Post #19 of 37 (36799 views)
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Re: [taylor] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

>How is it possible to have the software create the threads for me?

When you create a thread you're actually just submitting a form. All that's happening is your browser is requesting a script from the server and sending a list of the form field names and their values to the server. With "GET" forms you often see these in the address bar of your browser "id=333&action=save" and so on. With POST forms you don't see it but it gets sent pretty much the same.

We'd just have some easy way for you to figure out what the form field names were (you can do it with view-source in your browser, we'll try to make it easier) and enter them in the program. The program will then do the same thing you browser does, request a page and submit the form values. Only it will have them already entered in advance. More or less it will pretending to be your browser.

>But with all of those forums, is it hard on your server? I have vbulletin
>php/mysql and I plan on posting 3-5 articles per day.

It's really just the same as if someone created 3-5 new threads a day and a bunch of people commented on those. Any sort of comments system is going to require a program to run on the server and I'd imagine that forums would be optimized to handle a little bit of load.

Dave Edis - Senior Developer
interactivetools.com

MalaK_3araby
User

Aug 26, 2002, 10:50 PM

Post #20 of 37 (36773 views)
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Re: [Dave] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Choices .. Choices :)

I can think of sites i administer that does not want to pay for VBulletin .. and do not want a Board,
and there are sites that already use VBulletin and would love to have AM as an integradted CMS.

If possbile, both are wanted ..
if not ..
a Stand-Alone comments system with Rating is my choice.

--------------
Sure you can spell it, but do you get it?

synergy
User

Aug 27, 2002, 2:43 AM

Post #21 of 37 (36764 views)
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Re: [MalaK_3araby] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Quote

If possbile, both are wanted ..
if not ..
a Stand-Alone comments system with Rating is my choice

if you decide to do "just" a comments system, then pls with the possibility to have a threaded view, means the system should have the option that one can either answer on comments of someone else or post a new one.

otherwise, if you have a wellvisited site you easily get a few hundred comments below each other and that is simply unpractical for readers (and editors as well).

taylor
User

Aug 27, 2002, 8:03 AM

Post #22 of 37 (36759 views)
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Re: [MalaK_3araby] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

I agree with Malak_3araby. Smile

Taylor

Dave
Staff / Moderator

Aug 27, 2002, 9:26 AM

Post #23 of 37 (36753 views)
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Re: [taylor] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Ok, let's get started with the comments script that integrates with a forum. We need a volunteer with artman and a forum, and we'll need access to create threads (not forums. so that's probably just regular user access).

If anyone who can help can just let me know and tell me what kind of forum you have. We can test with gforum but I'd like to have some default support for the other top forums too.

Step up, step up! Be the first to try this amazing new technology (that we plan on inventing shortly <grin>)!

Dave Edis - Senior Developer
interactivetools.com

MalaK_3araby
User

Aug 27, 2002, 2:07 PM

Post #24 of 37 (36743 views)
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Re: [Dave] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

<steps up>

I will go set things up for testing .. and i do not mind if someone beats me to it.

--------------
Sure you can spell it, but do you get it?

Dave
Staff / Moderator

Aug 27, 2002, 2:08 PM

Post #25 of 37 (36742 views)
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Re: [MalaK_3araby] Comments Script - what features? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Great, what forum software do you have?

Dave Edis - Senior Developer
interactivetools.com

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